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Interpreting Revelation

Interpreting Revelation

Postby postodave » July 21st, 2007, 11:25 am

My minister sent me this. I thought it was one of the most lucid things I have seen on Revelation:

Anyone else like it?
So I drew my sword and got ready
But the lamb ran away with the crown
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Postby Arjy » September 16th, 2007, 4:28 am

Ive been researching on this site for the last few days,and ive come to the conclusion that his ideas on revelation are spot on.It has cleared up my confusion on the subject and made my faith stronger in the process,as confusion leads to doubt quite often.Revelation was my first ever bible study,talk about jumping in at the deep end :toothy-grin:
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My own musing on Revelation

Postby Steve » September 16th, 2007, 11:24 am

I notice the article mentions chapter 12 quite briefly.
"Rev. 12 offers a picture of the birth and life of Christ which can be interpreted favorably under any paradigm. "

What I noticed recently in reading chapter 12 was the astonishing sequence.

We have the birth of Christ, and Christ's conflict with Satan (12:1-6).
Then we have "war in heaven" and Satan cast out of heaven.

But this is the reverse of the chronology as I've always understood it, that
Satan rebelled against God and was cast out of heaven long before Jesus' birth. Maybe Revelation shows this standard chronology is wrong -- after all, in Job Satan comes in and out of heaven to taunt God.

But even this doesn't fully resolve the discrepancy, I think. In Luke 10:17 Jesus says he saw Satan fall from heaven (past tense). This is before his , resurrection and ascension. But Rev 12 seems to mention the ascension in v 5 "her child was ed up to God and to his throne". So it seems clear that Rev 12 mentions the fall of Satan after Jesus' ascension, but Jesus before his ascension says Satan's fall has already happened.

Maybe this is as Lewis might say "the usual muddle about times when dealing with [eternity]." Maybe the apocalyptic vision is not in chronological order, which would make it highly dubious to attempt any kind of definitive interpretation as to when the events of Revelation have or will be fulfilled.
Psalm 139:17 How precious to me are your thoughts, God! How vast is the sum of them!
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Re: My own musing on Revelation

Postby Adam » September 16th, 2007, 4:37 pm

"Love is the only art that poorly imitates nature."
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Postby rusmeister » September 16th, 2007, 6:34 pm

"Eh? Two views? There are a dozen views about everything until you know the answer. Then there's never more than one."
Bill "The Blizzard" Hingest - That Hideous Strength
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Postby Adam » September 16th, 2007, 8:43 pm

"Love is the only art that poorly imitates nature."
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Postby rusmeister » September 16th, 2007, 10:09 pm

"Eh? Two views? There are a dozen views about everything until you know the answer. Then there's never more than one."
Bill "The Blizzard" Hingest - That Hideous Strength
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Postby Arjy » September 16th, 2007, 10:17 pm

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Postby Adam » September 16th, 2007, 10:21 pm

"Love is the only art that poorly imitates nature."
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Postby postodave » September 21st, 2007, 12:10 pm

So I drew my sword and got ready
But the lamb ran away with the crown
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Postby Stanley Anderson » September 21st, 2007, 2:50 pm

Scott Hahn's book, The Lamb's Supper: The Mass as Heaven on Earth talks about Revelation as a description of what is going on in Heaven and that, as he says, "The Mass--and I mean every single Mass--is heaven on earth". An Amazon review says, "The central thrust of this piece is that Catholic liturgy offers the best interpretive paradigm for studying the Book of Revelation." Hahn shows how the Mass reflects what we see of Heaven in Revelation.

Other quotes from Hahn and about the book (which I quickly gathered from the reader's comments on the Amazon page):

"We go to heaven when we go to Mass...This is not merely a symbol, not a metaphor, not a parable, not a figure of speech. It is real."

"When Jesus comes again at the end of time, He will not have a single drop more glory than He has right now upon the altars and in the tabernacles of our churches," Hahn writes. "God dwells among Mankind right now because the Mass is heaven on earth."

Hahn claims that these truths have been held by the Church since the beginning of Christianity

"I want to make clear that the idea behind this book is nothing new, and it's certainly not mine," writes Hahn. "It's as old as the Church, and the Church has never let go of it. ... [Yet] this idea, that the Mass is `heaven on earth,' arrives [today] as news, very good news."
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I can't go into great detail here without simply reproducing the book -- I recommend reading it (it is a fairly short book) for anyone interested in the subject. I think it will be a fascinating read whether one agrees with the premise or not. And it is especially useful to any Catholic to read -- even many cradle Catholics will find it new and invigorating.

--Stanley
…on a night of rain Frodo smelled a sweet fragrance on the air and heard the sound of singing that came over the water. And then it seemed to him that as in his dream in the house of Bombadil, the grey rain-curtain turned all to silver glass and was rolled back, and he beheld white shores and beyond them a fair green country under a swift sunrise.
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Postby Adam » September 21st, 2007, 4:46 pm

"Love is the only art that poorly imitates nature."
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Postby postodave » September 22nd, 2007, 11:46 am

So I drew my sword and got ready
But the lamb ran away with the crown
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Postby Adam » September 22nd, 2007, 5:27 pm

"Love is the only art that poorly imitates nature."
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Postby sehoy » September 22nd, 2007, 9:13 pm

The Lamb's Supper. I second the recommendation. I've never viewed Revalation the same again. Every time I step into the Mass, I am aware that I have stepped out of time and into Heaven. A pox on Apocolyptists!
cor meum vigilat
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