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Letter to my pastor concerning "The Truth Project"

Postby Tuke » March 16th, 2008, 2:29 am

"The 'great golden chain of Concord' has united the whole of Edmund Spenser's world.... Nothing is repressed; nothing is insubordinate. To read him is to grow in mental health." The Allegory Of Love (Faerie Queene)

2 Corinthians IV.17 The Weight of Glory
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Postby nomad » March 16th, 2008, 7:19 am

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"Well," said Pooh, "what I like best -- " and then he had to stop and think. Because although Eating Honey was a very good thing to do, there was a moment just before you began to eat it which was better than when you were, but he didn't know what it was called.
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Postby mitchellmckain » March 16th, 2008, 9:08 am

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Postby Tuke » March 16th, 2008, 7:54 pm

Last edited by Tuke on March 18th, 2008, 11:20 am, edited 1 time in total.
"The 'great golden chain of Concord' has united the whole of Edmund Spenser's world.... Nothing is repressed; nothing is insubordinate. To read him is to grow in mental health." The Allegory Of Love (Faerie Queene)

2 Corinthians IV.17 The Weight of Glory
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Postby postodave » March 16th, 2008, 9:26 pm

So I drew my sword and got ready
But the lamb ran away with the crown
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Re: Letter to my pastor concerning "The Truth Project&q

Postby Ben2747 » March 17th, 2008, 2:12 am

Mitchell - as you probably are aware, I'm a fairly insular person when it comes to the raging debates of today, mostly because they are only faint shadows of the substantive debates of yesterday. Ill-formed notions shrieked by ill-formed intellects, with all the definition and critical distinctions removed. How can one really get that motivated to choose between patently false alternatives? Soooooo . . . I'm not really that well-informed about the whole Intelligent Design argument. Some very sad attempt to articulate the Five Ways, I suppose, but adapted to a modern audience?

In any case, I'm not really that interested. There IS, however, an interesting and perennial question about what constitutes "science." What exactly is the knowing faculty? How is it that we move from observation to knowledge? What kinds of things constitute the objects of this knowledge? It's also interesting to think about the history of science - Bacon, Galileo, and Descartes are three of the most interesting thinkers in the development of what we call, today, "science." Leaving aside the question of what the Intelligent Design proponents would argue, I would note that those who considered themselves to be scientists in the best sense thought they were talking about scientific things when they spoke of the Prime Mover. In fact, they thought the entire subject of Metaphysics was, itself, the highest and most advanced application of the mind and rigorous analysis to things considered in themselves. God's existence, immateriality, unity, eternity, primacy, omnipotence, etc., etc., were not really considered to belong to opinion, superstition, or even religion. By starting with what is most known, to us, the great thinkers of the West believed that they arrived at that which is most known, in itself - something which is only observed through its creation. I suppose physical, repeatable experiments could form the basis for some of the premises, but at some point, the syllogism takes over. Is this philosophy, and not science? Does the question even make sense, when one is the love of wisdom, and the other is knowing?

The whole argument about what is and is not "science" has become, frankly, rather shrill and pointless. It's a subject fit for theorists without scientific training, or for scientists without any ability to reflect on their own discipline or history. What is much MORE interesting is the question about what is the proper object of the faculty of reason - and what kinds of conclusions can really been known through this activity.

Whatever brainwashing and blasphemy against the sacred canon of modern science you think might be occuring in this class, there is probably ample room to question the blunders and dogmatism of science. Is anything so sacred really being harmed, here? Is it really worth the indignation?
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Postby mitchellmckain » March 17th, 2008, 9:38 am

Tuke and postodave,

Thanks to both of you for what you have shared.

Ben2747,

The last class that upset me so much was very difficult but an objective look at me during the class could be a little humorous too. I was grumbling through most of it unable to contain my outrage, but the funny thing was that some of my outrage was directed at Tackett and some of it was against things he quoted Dawkins saying. LOL. It confirms something I told my pastor a while ago -- that I am a radical moderate.
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Postby Ben2747 » March 17th, 2008, 1:12 pm

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Postby john » March 17th, 2008, 3:58 pm

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Postby mitchellmckain » March 17th, 2008, 6:47 pm

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Postby Tuke » March 17th, 2008, 7:38 pm

Last edited by Tuke on March 18th, 2008, 10:39 am, edited 2 times in total.
"The 'great golden chain of Concord' has united the whole of Edmund Spenser's world.... Nothing is repressed; nothing is insubordinate. To read him is to grow in mental health." The Allegory Of Love (Faerie Queene)

2 Corinthians IV.17 The Weight of Glory
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Postby alecto » March 17th, 2008, 9:50 pm

Sentio ergo est.
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Postby alecto » March 17th, 2008, 10:21 pm

Sentio ergo est.
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Postby john » March 17th, 2008, 10:23 pm

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Postby Tuke » March 17th, 2008, 11:52 pm

"The 'great golden chain of Concord' has united the whole of Edmund Spenser's world.... Nothing is repressed; nothing is insubordinate. To read him is to grow in mental health." The Allegory Of Love (Faerie Queene)

2 Corinthians IV.17 The Weight of Glory
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