Into the Wardrobe

This is getting very interesting. I'm glad I shifted some of my debates with Mitch to a new thread, since this has drawn Ben in. I find this quite illuminating. I wonder if what has been modified by discoveries in quantum physics is not so much the basic premises of logic as the concept of existence - that is to say yes there has been a metaphysical change but the logic remains intact just as the premises of logic remain intact whether you see them as being about things or about propositions or even as being imperatives about how to think.

I meant what I said about discussing our metaphysical differences some time Ben. I might gain a clearer understanding of Aquinas as a result. Mitch is not quite right in saying that I don't think part of God's knowledge is of necessary things. Rather all believe that all types of necessity such as logical, metaphysical, biological are created by God. Hence God knows what he has created and made necessary. I do not think there are necessities that stand over both God and creation. Nor do I believe that these necessities are aspects of God's being that flow over into creation which is my understanding of Aquinas' position.

As an example of the kind of debate that can go on between Calvinist and Thomist you could follow this link and download the essay on Reason and Belief in God. But if you are busy at the moment I'll understand.

Mitch you owe me a couple of replies - when you're ready of course.

Rarely have I amassed so many "LOL's" and "head-shakes" in such a short period of time. I don't really know what to say, Mitch. I was suggesting that you and Dave (is that "postodave's" name?) consider some of the existing metaphysical arguments about whether created beings can subsist apart from God, and thought I provided some interesting and useful references. I thought this would be a useful alternative to any appeal to the Fathers, councils, etc. I was hoping to at least get you in some sort of position to at least talk about it, but I think that anything that would be proposed is sort of damned by association, and it's better to not drag everything through the mud. Clearly, your mind is made up about the value of those references, as well as my own motives. I'm sure you have reasons for what you believe - and you have made it abundantly clear that you are set in your opinion. Fair enough - it was just a suggestion. I will withdraw to allow you to continue your theological debate.