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Luther and the new look on Paul v Christianity and Judaism

Postby Adam » August 21st, 2008, 6:35 am

"Love is the only art that poorly imitates nature."
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Postby Adam » August 21st, 2008, 6:48 am

"Love is the only art that poorly imitates nature."
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Postby JRosemary » August 21st, 2008, 7:11 am

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Postby JRosemary » August 21st, 2008, 7:32 am

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Postby JRosemary » August 21st, 2008, 8:38 am

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Postby postodave » August 21st, 2008, 9:01 pm

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But the lamb ran away with the crown
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Postby JRosemary » August 21st, 2008, 9:16 pm

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Postby Adam Linton » August 21st, 2008, 9:16 pm

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Postby JRosemary » August 21st, 2008, 9:33 pm

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Postby Adam Linton » August 22nd, 2008, 12:40 am

I thought that I'd take it back to the main thread theme.

I've been tremendously interested in NPP for a long time.

Karen made reference to him in her first post on this thread, but I'd like to highlight the work of James D. G. Dunn; a key scholar in the movement.

Very recently released--and containing all his major essays on Paul over the last twenty-five years--is Dunn's The New Perspective on Paul (revised edition), from Eerdmans. There's a lot there but well worth it, in my view.

But perhaps a better first time read in the NPP would be Wright's What Saint Paul Really Said (also from Eerdmans***). Very solid, but a more modest work compared with some others--and generally approachable.

For those really interested: Here's a link to an extended conversation between Wright and Dunn--linked from the N. T. Wright Page--giving ample demonstration both of their likenesses and differences. Fascinating, helpful, and a bit academically heavy-duty:

http://www.ntwrightpage.com/Dunn_Wright ... sation.pdf

And I think that Krister Stendahl's name much deserves mention. He passed away only a few months ago--one of the more important names in New Testament scholarship in the last fifty years. His 1963 lecture "Paul Among Jews and Gentiles" really lit the NPP fuse. It can be found in Stendahl's collection of essays by the same name (Augberg Fortress)--which also includes the very important, "The Apostle Paul and the Introspective Conscience of the West." It is simply not possible ever to read Paul in quite the same way after pondering these.

Stendahl also was one of the most effective scholarly voices challenging Christian "supersessionism" in regard to Judaism.

Regards.

Adam Linton

*** Given how many of their books that I buy and read, maybe I ought to buy stock in Eerdmans.
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Postby JRosemary » August 22nd, 2008, 1:35 am

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Postby Adam Linton » August 22nd, 2008, 1:53 am

Yes, for all that I think was valuable in Stendahl's work, neither was/am I able to buy this argument in his book on Romans (one of his later works). Too simplistic. Paul left things in unresolved/unresolvable tension (Romans 9-11). Accepting that is better than Stendahl's flattening things out in this case. Better to ponder the mystery.

Yet he was a great and gracious man. About ten years ago I was part of a combination academic symposium/spiritual retreat--which he lead--involving Jewish rabbis (across the spectrum) and Christian clergy (in this case, mostly Roman Catholics, Lutherans, and Episcopalians). Wonderful; just wonderful. Workout for the mind; refreshment for the spirit.

All things considered, it seems clear to me that Wright and Dunn took the NPP much farther down the road, in terms of scholarship--and in better overall balance, in terms in what Paul really meant to say.
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Postby postodave » August 22nd, 2008, 9:22 pm

Hi Rosemary

Yes it was the pluralism that I was referring to when I talked of your perspective. I'm attracted to it because it allows all religions to be equally valid and I cannot accept it for exactly the same reason. I suppose it depends what you mean by valid. If we treat all religions as perspectival hypothesees, as different possible ways of looking at the world, which we must do if we are to dialogue then all of them can be seen as equally valid.

However if I try to regard all of them as equally true then I think what really happens is that I replace all existing religions with a new meta religion. This may be less of a problem from a Jewish perspective where there is more emphasis on practice and less on conceptual content than there is in Christianity but for me as a Christian in order to accept a pluralist approach I would have to distort my own faith beyond recognition in order to fit it into this pluralist meta religion.

Adam - the dialogue between Wright and Dunn, or rather the second half of it, was the first thing I read when I followed the link to the new look web page Karen gave. I have read 'What Paul really said'. I found it very interesting. I sometimes have a problem hanging on to these ideas though because I'm so used to Luther's approach it seems like the natural reading.
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Postby JRosemary » August 22nd, 2008, 11:03 pm

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Postby mitchellmckain » August 23rd, 2008, 6:56 am

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