This forum was closed on October 1st, 2010. However, the archives are open to the public and filled with vast amounts of good reading and information for you to enjoy. If you wish to meet some Wardrobians, please visit the Into the Wardrobe Facebook group.

Lewis and language

The man. The myth.

Postby carol » April 21st, 2007, 6:11 am

Scholars in the past used Latin as a common spoken and written language between people of different countries. Documents and laws were written in Latin, church services were spoken in Latin, and knowledge of Latin showed you had education.

But by the early 20th century, Latin and Ancient Greek were being taught as written languages only, with very little speaking. They were taught as a means to study "the classics", and as a useful background to understanding one's own language.

In my early high school years I had three years of Latin, most of which I have forgotten, but which I found to be useful in understanding English, French, German grammar, and also New Testament Greek which I studied six years after I finished Latin. But we seldom spoke Latin, only read it aloud, which is very different.

I think that Lewis could have quoted and remembered plenty of the Latin and Greek he'd read, due to his having an amazing memory, but I cannot imagine him sitting conversing [eg with the Inklings at the pub] in Latin or Greek!
Image
carol
Wardrobian
 
Posts: 3673
Joined: Apr 1999
Location: New Zealand

Postby Paul F. Ford » April 22nd, 2007, 1:51 am

Paul Ford—self-appointed president of the "245-3617 Club" and proud member of the "245-6317 Club"; author of the Companion to Narnia and the Pocket Companion to Narnia.
Paul F. Ford
Wardrobian
 
Posts: 204
Joined: Dec 2004
Location: Camarillo, California

Postby Mornamoice » May 3rd, 2007, 1:18 am

Mornamoice
Wardrobian
 
Posts: 666
Joined: Sep 2005
Location: Southern California

Postby Ste-vo » May 3rd, 2007, 4:01 pm

"Further up and Further in!"
User avatar
Ste-vo
Wardrobian
 
Posts: 3554
Joined: Dec 2005
Location: The Fortress of Fortitude

Postby mgton » May 5th, 2007, 2:19 am

User avatar
mgton
Wardrobian
 
Posts: 55
Joined: Dec 2005

Postby Anne Elk [Miss] » May 5th, 2007, 4:55 pm

Greek is going to be harder if you don't know Latin. Unless you've previously learned an inflected language (one where you change the precise function of a word in a sentence by changing the ending), starting the two together might be rather difficult. Greek has a rather similar format to Latin, as it's also inflected, but there are even more inflections to learn - there's a middle voice in addition to the active and passive, an optative and a subjunctive where Latin uses the subjunctive to cover both, etc. Also, there's simply the added barrier in Greek of learning to use a new alphabet, although honestly that goes away after the first month or two.

That said, if you wanted to learn <i>just</i> New Testament Greek, that changes things somewhat, because it's much simpler to learn than classical Greek. If you're taking regular Greek courses, however, it's likely you'll start with classical so that you can do either later on.

Still, I wouldn't recommend trying to start both Greek and Latin together. It's simply a ton to memorize, and you have to get used to the idea of an inflected language. Once you've moved to the level in one of reading a text and looking up vocabulary, rather than spending all your time on grammar and vocab, that's when I'd start the other.

But you asked about suggestions for Latin specifically. Hm. I found getting a musical rhythym in my head that I could fit strings of endings to worked well. You're going to have to mutter endings and principal parts to yourself a lot before they stick; putting them to a tune helps them stick a little better.

Also, the subjunctive is your mortal enemy for the first few weeks you're trying to understand it, and then eventually it becomes just as easy to use as the indicative mood. Really.

Good luck! It's always nice to see fellow classics enthusiasts. :)
This post was made by Sarah. All the ideas expressed therein are original to me, except when they are not.
(Karen's daughter).
Anne Elk [Miss]
Wardrobian
 
Posts: 12
Joined: Jan 2005
Location: Near Philadelphia, PA

Postby Karen » May 5th, 2007, 5:05 pm

[motherly aside]Hi sweetie. :smile: [/motherly aside]
I have always imagined that paradise will be a kind of library. -- Jorge Luis Borges
User avatar
Karen
Wardrobian
 
Posts: 3733
Joined: Jul 2002
Location: Pennsylvania, USA

Postby Stanley Anderson » May 6th, 2007, 3:17 pm

…on a night of rain Frodo smelled a sweet fragrance on the air and heard the sound of singing that came over the water. And then it seemed to him that as in his dream in the house of Bombadil, the grey rain-curtain turned all to silver glass and was rolled back, and he beheld white shores and beyond them a fair green country under a swift sunrise.
User avatar
Stanley Anderson
Wardrobian
 
Posts: 3251
Joined: Aug 1996
Location: Southern California

Postby Karen » May 6th, 2007, 9:21 pm

I have always imagined that paradise will be a kind of library. -- Jorge Luis Borges
User avatar
Karen
Wardrobian
 
Posts: 3733
Joined: Jul 2002
Location: Pennsylvania, USA

Postby carol » May 8th, 2007, 9:42 am

Greek grammar is the basis of Latin grammar, since the Romans had no ideas of their own - they borrowed their mythology, their stories, their religion, their grammar, etc.... and probably their laws too, from Greece.

It's worth reminding any aspiring tourist/scholar that Greek as it is spoken today is a lot different from the Classical Greek (which was also somewhat different from Biblical Greek, which was a sort of common trade language version known as Koine "coy-neigh"). But good luck, and persist, and you will be pleased with your results in the end!
Image
carol
Wardrobian
 
Posts: 3673
Joined: Apr 1999
Location: New Zealand

Off Topic

Postby interloper » May 8th, 2007, 9:08 pm

User avatar
interloper
Wardrobian
 
Posts: 670
Joined: Sep 2006
Location: Lat 51° 8' 43.7" N, Long 0° 29' 11.7" W

Postby Anne Elk [Miss] » May 9th, 2007, 12:19 pm

This post was made by Sarah. All the ideas expressed therein are original to me, except when they are not.
(Karen's daughter).
Anne Elk [Miss]
Wardrobian
 
Posts: 12
Joined: Jan 2005
Location: Near Philadelphia, PA

Postby Karen » May 9th, 2007, 1:09 pm

I have always imagined that paradise will be a kind of library. -- Jorge Luis Borges
User avatar
Karen
Wardrobian
 
Posts: 3733
Joined: Jul 2002
Location: Pennsylvania, USA

Postby Guest » May 9th, 2007, 1:28 pm

Guest
 

Postby Karen » May 9th, 2007, 2:43 pm

Heh. :smile:
I have always imagined that paradise will be a kind of library. -- Jorge Luis Borges
User avatar
Karen
Wardrobian
 
Posts: 3733
Joined: Jul 2002
Location: Pennsylvania, USA

PreviousNext

Return to C. S. Lewis

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered members and 15 guests

cron