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When Susan stopped believing

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When Susan stopped believing

Postby Lirenel » July 27th, 2008, 3:50 am

Ever since I first read the Last Battle, I have wondered just when Susan forgot Narnia, or at least started pretending it was just a childhood game. Obviously we see the beginning of her fall in Prince Caspian where she seems to lack the faith of the other children, where she just doesn't seem to love Narnia as much (at least how I saw it). I think I have always assumed that Susan stopped believing after Prince Caspian, or during her trip to America during VODT. The American trip especially seemed to me to almost symbolize her growing away from her siblings and trying to grow up.

But then I was rereading the Last Battle, or at least part of it, and I noticed that one of the characters who complained the most about Susan "growing up" was Jill. In fact Jill specifically says "Oh Susan!...she's interested in nothing now-a-days except nylons and lipstick and invitations. She always was a jolly sight too keen on being grown-up." (emphasis mine). Jill sounds like she was quite familiar with Susan before she turned from Narnia. The fact that Jill seemed to have known Susan fairly well means that Susan did not turn completely away from Narnia until after the Silver Chair, and probably some time afterwards.

That just stuck out at me because I had assumed that, once Aslan informed her she was not returning to Narnia, that Susan had turned her back on Narnia as she felt Aslan had turned his back on her (my interpretation again). The fact that it took a few years for her to 'forget' Narnia changes that quite a bit.

So now I'm back to wondering what it was that really made Susan stop believing. Was it abrupt, or did she just start gradually moving away from belief because it was easier to just not talk about Narnia than to continually remember a land she could no longer get to?

Just thought it was interesting since it changed my mental timeline. And my mental timeline has issues with being changed. :toothy-grin:
The Lord is my light and my salvation, whom shall I fear? The Lord is the stronghold of my life, of whom shall I be afraid? - Psalm 27:1

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Re: When Susan stopped believing

Postby Leslie » July 27th, 2008, 10:01 pm

"What are you laughing at?"
"At myself. My little puny self," said Phillipa.
--Rumer Godden, In This House of Brede
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Postby Lirenel » July 27th, 2008, 10:27 pm

The only reason I think Jill might have befriended Susan before Susan stopped believing really is the quote I posted. It just seems weird to me that a girl who only had an outsider's view of Susan would be so hard on her. It actually would be quite rude to deride Susan in front of her family unless Jill had also once been close with Susan and then Susan fell away from the group.

Eustace is family and thus can complain all he wants. Polly is an elder who can, with the wisdom of her years, exclaim over "kids these days". Jill, if she never really knew Susan well and wasn't a friend, does not really have a right to complain about her. (and I can't imagine Susan post-belief associating closely with one of her cousin's friends whose only connection is Narnia)

Of course, it all could be that Jack needed someone to say that paragraph, and Jill was the one through process of elimination: Eustace and Polly already had their paragraphs, and Polly spoke for the point of view of her and Digory's generation. Peter doesn't seem to want to talk about Susan ("My sister Susan," answered Peter shortly and gravely, "is no longer a friend of Narnia." emphasis mine). Lucy can't speak because in the next chapter her first words are specifically noted. I could see Edmund saying Jill's lines, but I think he would be like Peter and not really want to think about Susan not being with them.

I am possibly putting way too much thought into this. :wink:
The Lord is my light and my salvation, whom shall I fear? The Lord is the stronghold of my life, of whom shall I be afraid? - Psalm 27:1

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Postby Leslie » July 27th, 2008, 10:43 pm

"What are you laughing at?"
"At myself. My little puny self," said Phillipa.
--Rumer Godden, In This House of Brede
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Postby carol » July 28th, 2008, 10:12 am

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Postby john » July 28th, 2008, 3:57 pm

It sounds to me like Jill was just being a typical 16 year-old, speaking in absolutes. If I had a penny for every time I've heard teenagers say things like "you always do that" or "you never do that" -- well, I'd have about $5.63.
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Postby Leslie » July 28th, 2008, 10:43 pm

"What are you laughing at?"
"At myself. My little puny self," said Phillipa.
--Rumer Godden, In This House of Brede
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Postby john » July 29th, 2008, 4:17 am

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Postby Leslie » July 30th, 2008, 11:53 pm

"What are you laughing at?"
"At myself. My little puny self," said Phillipa.
--Rumer Godden, In This House of Brede
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Postby john » July 31st, 2008, 12:02 am

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Postby Larry W. » August 1st, 2008, 10:57 am

I was never really certain when Susan stopped believing. She doesn't actually talk about her faith very much in the books. And after Prince Caspian she is mentioned very little except as an historical reference to the Kings and Queens of Narnia and also the incident of her adolescent behavior in The Last Battle. I always thought of Susan as being more of a reserved person, more shy than Lucy in talking about what Aslan meant to her. It seems to have been a private thing between her and the Lion since we aren't told much even about her straying.

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Postby Tharkun » August 3rd, 2008, 6:26 pm

I must have something to work on...I cannot burn snow.

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Postby Lirenel » August 3rd, 2008, 8:40 pm

The Lord is my light and my salvation, whom shall I fear? The Lord is the stronghold of my life, of whom shall I be afraid? - Psalm 27:1

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Postby Tharkun » August 4th, 2008, 2:45 pm

I must have something to work on...I cannot burn snow.

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Postby Larry W. » August 4th, 2008, 3:10 pm

I remember running into this webpage a long time ago when looking up websites about Narnia: . I think it is too judgmental about Susan when it compares her to Judas. If he were living today, Lewis would probably have been a little disgusted at this portrayal of his character. He was reluctant to judge people and was especially patient with people who strayed-- in part because he understood himself in the difficult process of his own conversion.

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