This forum was closed on October 1st, 2010. However, the archives are open to the public and filled with vast amounts of good reading and information for you to enjoy. If you wish to meet some Wardrobians, please visit the Into the Wardrobe Facebook group.

Not relying on anything but God's Word

Not relying on anything but God's Word

Postby Stanley Anderson » February 17th, 2009, 11:30 pm

…on a night of rain Frodo smelled a sweet fragrance on the air and heard the sound of singing that came over the water. And then it seemed to him that as in his dream in the house of Bombadil, the grey rain-curtain turned all to silver glass and was rolled back, and he beheld white shores and beyond them a fair green country under a swift sunrise.
User avatar
Stanley Anderson
Wardrobian
 
Posts: 3251
Joined: Aug 1996
Location: Southern California

Re: Not relying on anything but God's Word

Postby Lioba » February 18th, 2009, 6:47 am

Stanley in my eyes you mix two questions:
On what basics does my belief rely?
How do I understand and interpret them?
The good old protestant answer to the first question is Sola Scriptura. Every addtional source of wisdom is to be measured on scripture. Regarding the traditions of the church this means that everything important should be build on this fundament.
So in this first Michaels denomination is far from being extremely individualistic or elusive.
The question of interpretation is the next question. It is no good to mix them.
So your attack on Michael is not only unnessecarily harsh but the argument isn´t really consistent.
Why protestants have come to so diverging interpretations is still an important questions and that´s a week point. But I can say that in Europe the Situation was clearly different from the States. The protestant Churches were either lutheran or calvinistic. The groups who do not practise childbaptisme were and still are generally calvinistic and a minority .The two branches of the church in Germany were politically forced to unite. This together with the development of liberal theology weekend the position of mainstream protestantisme and led to the streghtening of smaller denominations.But until the last half of the last century people held strongly to the concept of the church and not many little churches and denominations and the most criticisme against this ideal of consistency and visible unity always came from the USA and all Americans I know use the totally wrong term of "State church" as an open insult to the great churches in germany, catholic and protestant.
Iustitia est ad alterum.
User avatar
Lioba
Wardrobian
 
Posts: 320
Joined: Oct 2007

Re: Not relying on anything but God's Word

Postby Bluegoat » February 18th, 2009, 12:23 pm

User avatar
Bluegoat
 
Posts: 206
Joined: Dec 2008
Location: Nova Scotia

Re: Not relying on anything but God's Word

Postby Stanley Anderson » February 18th, 2009, 3:55 pm

…on a night of rain Frodo smelled a sweet fragrance on the air and heard the sound of singing that came over the water. And then it seemed to him that as in his dream in the house of Bombadil, the grey rain-curtain turned all to silver glass and was rolled back, and he beheld white shores and beyond them a fair green country under a swift sunrise.
User avatar
Stanley Anderson
Wardrobian
 
Posts: 3251
Joined: Aug 1996
Location: Southern California

Re: Not relying on anything but God's Word

Postby Lioba » February 18th, 2009, 4:14 pm

Iustitia est ad alterum.
User avatar
Lioba
Wardrobian
 
Posts: 320
Joined: Oct 2007

Re: Not relying on anything but God's Word

Postby john » February 18th, 2009, 4:28 pm

john
Chief Wardrobian
User avatar
john
Chief Wardrobian
 
Posts: 6495
Joined: Jul 1996
Location: near seattle

Re: Not relying on anything but God's Word

Postby Stanley Anderson » February 18th, 2009, 4:40 pm

…on a night of rain Frodo smelled a sweet fragrance on the air and heard the sound of singing that came over the water. And then it seemed to him that as in his dream in the house of Bombadil, the grey rain-curtain turned all to silver glass and was rolled back, and he beheld white shores and beyond them a fair green country under a swift sunrise.
User avatar
Stanley Anderson
Wardrobian
 
Posts: 3251
Joined: Aug 1996
Location: Southern California

Re: Not relying on anything but God's Word

Postby Lioba » February 18th, 2009, 4:45 pm

Stanley- I think I saw the harshness not only towards the person of Michael- , but in your general judgement of protestantisme.Remember: many protestant minority- groups that couldn´t cope with any of the greater churches found a home in America. the good thing about this is the freedom and independance of the religious life in the States, the hrm difficult aspect of it is that those little denominations have often in themselves a inherant tendency to separatisme and individuality .In the Old World we still see the 2 great schismata as tragic events and not the original will of our Lord.
[quote][As an additional point, what if Scripture itself points to something away from itself (and in doing so, not "in place of", but "in addition to" itself of course)? /quote]
Well- IF it really does- for example does scripture say that the Apostle Peter "holds the keys" or all his successors?
That´s what I meant with the two different questions.
Is scripture the foundation of Christian teaching - yes.
Do all three great branches of Christianity interprete it equally - no.
The primacy of the Apostle Peter himself is rather obvious and needs no interpretation.
But what about his successors? Here are disagreements.
But differences in interpretation are not the same as wanton separatisme and arbitrariness.
Iustitia est ad alterum.
User avatar
Lioba
Wardrobian
 
Posts: 320
Joined: Oct 2007

Re: Not relying on anything but God's Word

Postby archenland_knight » February 18th, 2009, 4:50 pm

Romans 5:8 "But God demonstrates his own love for us in this: While we were still sinners, Christ died for us."
User avatar
archenland_knight
Wardrobian
 
Posts: 774
Joined: Aug 2008
Location: Obviously at a computer keyboard

Re: Not relying on anything but God's Word

Postby Stanley Anderson » February 18th, 2009, 4:58 pm

…on a night of rain Frodo smelled a sweet fragrance on the air and heard the sound of singing that came over the water. And then it seemed to him that as in his dream in the house of Bombadil, the grey rain-curtain turned all to silver glass and was rolled back, and he beheld white shores and beyond them a fair green country under a swift sunrise.
User avatar
Stanley Anderson
Wardrobian
 
Posts: 3251
Joined: Aug 1996
Location: Southern California

Re: Not relying on anything but God's Word

Postby john » February 18th, 2009, 5:06 pm

Stanley, after almost 13 years, I know you well enough to understand that you had good intentions. :)

But I also don't believe it's wise to make so many assumptions toward others. In my mind, it has little to do with how "easily offended" somebody might be, and more to do with how necessary the approach and wording was in the first place.

:rolleyes:
john
Chief Wardrobian
User avatar
john
Chief Wardrobian
 
Posts: 6495
Joined: Jul 1996
Location: near seattle

Re: Not relying on anything but God's Word

Postby Stanley Anderson » February 18th, 2009, 6:05 pm

…on a night of rain Frodo smelled a sweet fragrance on the air and heard the sound of singing that came over the water. And then it seemed to him that as in his dream in the house of Bombadil, the grey rain-curtain turned all to silver glass and was rolled back, and he beheld white shores and beyond them a fair green country under a swift sunrise.
User avatar
Stanley Anderson
Wardrobian
 
Posts: 3251
Joined: Aug 1996
Location: Southern California

Re: Not relying on anything but God's Word

Postby Lioba » February 18th, 2009, 6:28 pm

Stanley- I also know you for a while and I surely have no intention to get into a longterm quarrel. :smile:
About discussions- I believe that they often end in a "war" because we forget, that a good discussion not only consists of talking ( or writing) but as much in listening.
Iustitia est ad alterum.
User avatar
Lioba
Wardrobian
 
Posts: 320
Joined: Oct 2007

Re: Not relying on anything but God's Word

Postby Stanley Anderson » February 18th, 2009, 6:38 pm

…on a night of rain Frodo smelled a sweet fragrance on the air and heard the sound of singing that came over the water. And then it seemed to him that as in his dream in the house of Bombadil, the grey rain-curtain turned all to silver glass and was rolled back, and he beheld white shores and beyond them a fair green country under a swift sunrise.
User avatar
Stanley Anderson
Wardrobian
 
Posts: 3251
Joined: Aug 1996
Location: Southern California

Re: Not relying on anything but God's Word

Postby moogdroog » February 18th, 2009, 8:46 pm

User avatar
moogdroog
Wardrobian
 
Posts: 486
Joined: May 2007

Next

Return to Religion, Science, and Philosophy

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered members and 10 guests

cron