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Mark of the beast?

Postby WolfVanZandt » November 18th, 2006, 6:04 pm

One very important adjectiive - "Holy". Why would you call only one man Holy when we are all called to be holy. Jesus said, your leaders wll not be like the Gentiles that they rule over you - they will be your servants and the Pope rules over the Catholic church very much as one of those earhly leaders.

You set him aside (which is what "holiness" means) but you do so in ascendancy. He's not only set aside from the world, he's set aside from the church and he's set over the church in strict disobedience to Christ.

Further, do you kiss each other's hands? If you honored each other as you honor the Pope I would certainly not be tempted to see any particular idolatry there. Unfortunately that's not what I see nor is it what the rest of humanity sees.

The Lord says "do not" and the ECFs and popes say "do" - the essence of idolatry is placing something else before the Lord.

If the essence of Rome is idolatry and, particularly, emperor worship, then it never fell.
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Postby Pizza Man » November 18th, 2006, 8:40 pm

May God bless you!

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Postby Adam » November 18th, 2006, 9:20 pm

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Postby WolfVanZandt » November 18th, 2006, 9:58 pm

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Postby John Anthony » November 19th, 2006, 2:21 am

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Postby WolfVanZandt » November 19th, 2006, 2:37 am

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Postby Adam » November 19th, 2006, 2:55 am

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Postby Kolbitar » November 19th, 2006, 3:14 am

The man who lives in contact with what he believes to be a living Church is a man always expecting to meet Plato and Shakespeare tomorrow at breakfast. He is always expecting to see some truth that he has never seen before. --Chesterton

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Postby WolfVanZandt » November 19th, 2006, 3:42 am

Well, I agree with that, but, since I don't know what Revelation means and I know that Rome hasn't fallen......

Kolbitar, the Apostles quit betraying Christ. Best I can tell, the popes (the Roman Catholic system) quit killing other Christians when it became inconvenient to kill them. The other denominations became stronger and the secular world would no longer allow it. I suspect that there are Protestants and Catholics out there that, because of their tradition, would kill me simply for being a Werewolf that professes Christianity if it were not against the law of the land to do so.
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Postby Pizza Man » November 19th, 2006, 4:28 am

May God bless you!

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Postby WolfVanZandt » November 19th, 2006, 8:21 am

hat's right, Pizza Man, it s exactlylike a medieval peasant lifting a medieval king up - except, many of these "medieval peasants" I know are not stupid people. They're professionals and businessmen. And Jesus said not to do those things. He specifically said that our leaders are not to be as medieval kings (actually He said Gentile kings but there's little or no difference - they both "lord it over their subjects" which is what Jesus said not to do.

And when I say "destroy lives' I mean physically, mentally, and/or spiritually.

We Christians are all given the power of excommunication. That power is not intended to destroy people - ever.

Pizza Man, honestly, how many times do I have to tell you that I don't believe Revelation is talking about the Catholic church when it talks about Rome falling. It may be talking about the plitgical system surrounding the Catholic church but Iwould think it more likely a completely secular system arising out of the political system will be more likely. But as I said, I don't know what Revelation means - and I don't think you do either.

So quit putting words in my mouth.
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Postby WolfVanZandt » November 19th, 2006, 8:30 am

I think it s ludicrous, gven the behavior of the early American Christians, and the fact that the founding fathers were often operating on very nonChristian ideals, to call America a Christian nation based on Christian priciple, but God has blessed this country, belive because it has been a shelter for the true church. It has allowed a great missionary force to grow and spread out over the world.

I will say the same for the Catholic church. I believe it has propigated the spirit of Rome but, at the same time, it has sheltered the true church through a couple of thousand years. So, no, I don't think God is waiting to lower the boom on the Catholic church. And again, I believe that Catholics will go to heaven - not all of them, but I don't believe that of Baptists or any other denomination.
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Postby Kolbitar » November 19th, 2006, 12:36 pm

::Kolbitar, the Apostles quit betraying Christ. Best I can tell, the popes (the Roman Catholic system) quit killing other Christians when it became inconvenient to kill them. The other denominations became stronger and the secular world would no longer allow it. I suspect that there are Protestants and Catholics out there that, because of their tradition, would kill me simply for being a Werewolf that professes Christianity if it were not against the law of the land to do so.

Wolf, no more for me, I leave you to the comfort of your oversimplifications...

I wish you well in your Christian walk...

Jesse
The man who lives in contact with what he believes to be a living Church is a man always expecting to meet Plato and Shakespeare tomorrow at breakfast. He is always expecting to see some truth that he has never seen before. --Chesterton

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Postby WolfVanZandt » November 19th, 2006, 7:24 pm

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Postby Pizza Man » November 19th, 2006, 9:46 pm

May God bless you!

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